June 5, 2009

Art of the Min Raise (Part 16)

I don't know whether donkeys have been reading spritpot or just trying to get more clever in general, but I have been running into WAY more min 3-betting from aggro donkeys recently than I ever remember before.


Just as with normal 3-betting, it's somewhat difficult to combat when the villain is doing it with a wider range than AA/KK (where the clear response is to call with implied odds to get paid off huge if you nail the frop, like here). Of course, some of these donkeys are still willing to stack off with any pair post-frop after they min 3-bet pre-frop (see here and here).

But I'm wondering if I should start again playing my AK/AQ type hands more aggressively in these situations against players that have a lot more than AA and KK in their range. Here's an example from yesterday:

CO: $42.00
BTN: $199.40
SB: $64.15
BB: $4.60
Hero (UTG): $50.00
UTG+1: $97.25
MP1: $33.60
MP2: $50.95

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is UTG with Ks Ah
Hero raises to $1.75, 3 folds, CO raises to $3, 3 folds, Hero calls $1.25 (Raise UTG, get min 3-bet...usually means strength...I had like 12 hands on this guy and he had been really aggro, but I chickened out and just called. Calling a 3-bet out of position with AK is pretty crappy, but I can't exactly fold given these odds and the aggro opponent, even over a small sample, and 4-betting seems fraught with peril as well. If I make a smallish 4-bet to say, $9, he's going to call with about anything, and never be folding a pair or decent draw on the frop. Since I'm OOP, I'm going to have to take a stab at it, say $12 or so. Then I've already put in $21, and I'll pretty much have to call off the final $21 with any equity at all. If I make a bigger 4-bet, to $12, I might deter a call from some of the weaker hands, making subsequent decisions less complicated, but of course I'm losing more money to his big pair hands. Suggestions, please...just insta-felt with AK vs. a guy that's this aggro, even over 15 hands?)

Flop: ($6.75) 8d 2s 3c (2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks (Whiff...preparing to check/fold...his check behind not indicative of the big pair he is representing...)

Turn: ($6.75) Th (2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks (Not much reason for me to bet...hoping to keep pot small...)

River: ($6.75) 2h (2 players)
Hero bets $4, CO calls $4 (I actually thought this was a value bet. I think he'd look me up with A-high. But instead he turned top pair...rame...)

Final Pot: $14.75
CO shows 9d Td (two pair, Tens and Twos)
Hero shows Ks Ah (a pair of Twos)
CO wins $14.05

So anyway he did run me down with T9 and got some minimal value...and I think I could get some decent value out of him if I did frop a pair...but I felt kinda lost on the hand in general and it made me wonder if I'm getting pwnd more than I think by donks min 3-betting prefrop and then continuing on the frop (if he bets the frop, I instaford). Have other players been seeing more of this as well?

-BRUECHIPS

6 comments:

James P McAteer said...

I agree calling isn't great with AK o - even with the odds. TBH - with odds I much prefer calling with SCs. I either fold (never folded AK yet) or 4-bet shove and close my eyes.

Sorry - this doesn't answer your question - but over the last 2 months I've been AI PF with AKo 10 times. 6 times I was ahead in equity. I only won twice out of ten... fml

Gnome said...

Maybe this is too simple-minded, but I find that shipping AK pre the vast majority of the time is largely unexploitable.

spritpot said...

To those advocating shipping AKo in this spot - the fact that I'm UTG doesn't change your opinion? What's your 4-bet sizing? Part of the difficulty of the min 3-b is that getting a fold with a 4-bet shove is much less profitable, because there's less dead money in the pot. Given that I don't think I get called by AQ that often, I think that's probably bad. What 4-bet size is mostly likely to induce either a call or a 5-bet shove from weaker hands?

spritpot said...

Also @ gnome: What if I had AQ instead?

Gnome said...

I like 4-betting to $12.

Gnome said...

re: AQ...that's tougher, and you'll have to rely more on your reads. I think calling would be fine with AQ, with an eye toward check-raising many flops.